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 Thank you Saints!

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:02 pm

Ok point two.

There D has been Miserable, especially there pass D since their last super bowl.

What did Brady do once welker went down? Complete 10 passes to edelman...

Again don't overplay brady and down play manning .

You mention the ability to win THIS year...again selective memory...I'm looking at a career not season...bc yes manning was better This year but again give me Brady thus far in there careers.

3 rings vs 1. You play to win the gm

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Wed Feb 10, 2010 6:38 pm

3 rings vs 1. ok but just remember how Brady got those 3 rings. And remeber how Manning won his and got a chance to win another
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:16 pm

Stock1528 wrote:
This is fun! Let's compare Brady's 2007 season to Manning's 2004 season.

The 1st big thing is that Brady played a FULL 16 games and had 50 TD's. Manning played 15 games and had 49. Avg. TD's Per Game- Brady-3.13 Manning-3.27

Brady's QB rating-117.2. Manning's QB rating-121.1

Brady fumbles lost-4. Manning-1.

Brady- 398 completions for 50 TD's. Manning- 336 completions for 49 TD's.

That's also the only season in Brady's career that he has over 29 TD's. Can you say fluke or as they call it, "Lightning in a Bottle?"

Some of Brady's TD's also came in garbage time like when they were up by 35 or whatever it was against the Redskins and they were still airing it out. Manning is a class act, Brady does garbage things like call a T.O before halftime against my Titans when they were already up by 28. This T.O wasn't to kick a FG, it was to go for a TD so Brady could get the record for TD's in a quarter. They run up scores and have no class and Belichick is a piece of crap and I have no respect for him or the Patriots.

Also, let's look at playoffs games compared to INT's.

Brady- 18 games-15 INT's Manning 18 games-18 INT's. Not much of a difference there is there? Brady also has 3 career playoff games with 3 or more INT's, Manning has had 1.

My point with all these stats is that Brady has not had to be perfect to win his SB's where Manning has. Manning never had Vinatieri to bail him out like Brady has, he always had Vanderjerk who did the complete opposite. Supporting cast makes a huge difference and to solely base greatness on SB rings is crazy. Look at Jim Kelly and Dan Marino. Hall of Famers and two of the best of all time. They have 0 Super Bowl rings because he didn't have the supporting cast to seal the deal. For example, Kelly's kicker missing the last second field goal against the NYG causing them to lose 20-19. Brady has always had the little things like a solid, clutch kicker and a solid D. Granted that isn't his fault but that is why I say that Super Bowl wins should not dictate greatness because it takes a great TEAM to get there, not necessarily a great QB. I will fight you to the death about this Gibs because I am very passionate about my hatred for the Patriots and I live in Rhode Island!

End Rant

If you want to look at the picks and say "not much of a difference" then we can say the same about the previous stats that you had posted..

Brady's QB rating and Manning's.. Not much of a difference

Bradys average TD's per game to Manning's.. Not much of a difference

Brady's fumbles lost to Manning's.. Not much of a difference

Brady has 3 playoff games with 3 or more picks to Manning's one.. Not much of a difference
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 12:13 am

Th3 Ac3r- I realize what you are saying. My point of saying that there isn't much of a difference was that Brady's 50 TD season was achieved with 1 more game and the rest of the stats Manning was better. My point of the playoff games/picks was that even though Brady has 3 rings to Manning's 1, it isn't like his playoffs stats are night and day compared to Manning's and he deserves the other 2 rings more than Manning would. Once again, this is where the supporting cast comes in.

2020- It is a big dream of mine to be an ESPN analyst but unfortunately that won't ever happen because I am not a former NFL player.

Gibs- Brees should thank Favre for the SB ring, not Hartley! haha. My point with that was Manning's kicker(Vanderjerk) has cost him chances at more playoff games and possibly SB's because he's a choke artist
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:42 am

You can't say things in retrospect. It is what it is...

Bc if your taking that view then I will as well and that will only make Brady look better. Bc he practically went 19-0. David tyree shouldn't have caught that ball. He should have 4 rings and orchestrated the most dominant team football has ever scene .

Well that never happened...we can't play what if...we have facts and the facts over a career show Brady is a better winner. QBs in this league DON'T last unless they WIN. They are paid for winning and leading their team. Over a career you can't make one argument to prove Manning is a better winner...better state yes...but at the end of the day...what's tje purpose of the game? To get tje most state or to finish on top.

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:01 am

18-1? does that fit anywhere into this? Probably

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:06 pm

Gibs- Who are your top 5 QB's of all time?
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 3:30 pm

Montana
Brady
Manning
Aikmen
Marino

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:08 pm

That completely contradicts your standards for why Brady is better than Manning Smile

Terry Bradshaw has 4 SB's. Where is he? There are a lot of people with more SB's than Marino and Manning, where are they?

This is fun isn't it? Haha
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:35 pm

Stock,

Your taking it to literal. Its not absolute as far as most rings equals best and vice versa.

I'm looking at a career and taking all into account. Bradshaws numbers were horrendous however he still won...he would be in my top 10. However when I look at the complete player I take everything into account. That list is primarily made of superbowl winners. I was skeptical of even putting marino on the list but still did.

I battled with elway. If you asked me to do the list over again in a week I might put elway there instead

Something to also note. Manning and Brady are so close in ability that "winning" is the deal breaker. Don't let short term memory cloud your jusgement. Bc if we had this convo before the 2007 super bowl it be very different as far as bradys is concerned. Look at them as a whole and not just...what have you done for me lately

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 5:59 pm

sgibs do u honestly think Brady is the better Qb than manning?
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:34 pm

Over their seperate CAREERS, Brady is a better QB.. All Manning fans just need to accept that.. He is a PROVEN winner and leader in the playoffs, overshadowing Manning where it counts THE MOST, in the playoffs.. All Manning fans want to focus on the stats, and his ability to audible at the line, and how he is his own offensive coordinator.. When at the end of that day, Brady has 3 rings to Mannings 1, and thats all that matters in football

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:41 pm

PeytonMvPManning wrote:
sgibs do u honestly think Brady is the better Qb than manning?

Yes I honestly do.

Over the course of a CAREER.

When you say who is better...it makes me think of this questions...

Who would you rather have as your QB?

If you were totaly abstract from the game...and 20 years from now someone came to you and asked would you rather a QB with 3 super bowl rings or 1. Easy decision right?

Manning was the better QB this season yes. Brady was the better QB in 2007 yes. Brady has had the better career. Because YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME. You dont play to put up good numbers. YOU PLAY TO WIN.

if you can take soliace and be ok with 1 ring thats fine...I want a winner...and Brady is the better winner.

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:55 pm

Ok I have cracked this code..........wait.....wait.....wait.......wait a sec more.....ok


Gibs you say that Brady is a winner. You confuse Brady himself with the team....The PATs are winners.

You say manning isnt a winner (in just) but you are wrong, he is just as much of a winner if not more than Brady is. The only diff is that the team in a whole are not winners (compared to the pats).

How can you say that manning out classes brady in just about every stat but brady is more of a winner than he is..... Its the teammmmmmmm

smh at the people who says that brady makes the tough clutch throws..... manning makes those throws all the time... But the diff is that the PATS WRs have more ice water in their veins to not choke on the catch. ANd the colts WRs have constantly choked over the past 7 or so years...And the latest example is in this SB....

.....i think i have gibs in cheakmate...lol jk. But I dnt see how you can respond to this
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:05 pm

Ac3r and Gibs- So 20 years from now you would want Big Ben, Aikman, Elway, Bradshaw and all the other QB's that have more rings than Manning because you play to win the game and that is all that matters right?

This has to be the deciding factor because if you compare CAREER stats, Manning has Brady beat in every single category!!!! The only one that Brady leads is rings which means that everyone with more rings than Manning must be better right? This is exactly what you guys are saying and it makes no sense what so ever.
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:19 pm

NO ONE CARES ABOUT STATS.. This is EXACTLY what i said in my previous post, that all Manning fans say "look at the stats! Manning is better!".. If you were to go up to a football coach and ask him do you want a 3 time championship winner or a player who has all the stats what do you think he would say?? It doesnt matter what team Manning is on, because honestly, I think he has had a MUCH better team that Brady over their careers.. It doesnt matter if Manning out classes Brady in every stat, its the fact that Brady has more rings, and thats all that matters.. Manning makes the clutch throws? Lets look at this from about 5 days ago.. Manning down 24-17, 4th quarter, super bowl, the UNSTOPPABLE Peyton Manning will lead his team down the field and score to tie the game, the super bowl.. What does he do? Chokes and throws a 74 yard pick 6.. Manning has alllllll the stats in the world in the REGULAR SEASON, but playoffs is where it matter and is where Manning continues to struggle.. Manning career in playoffs: 9-9.. Brady career in playoffs: 14-4.. WOW where it matter who comes through?? TOM BRADY.. Once again i will stress this to you guys, since this is your only point in your argument, STATS dont matter AT ALL in sports, all it is is a number.. Anyone can put up ridiculous numbers, look at Texas Tech QB's, Graham Harrell.. The guys stats were unbelievable, and where is he now?
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:24 pm

well yes thats right. I want rings not stats.

GIVE ME A WINNER


ok, im leaving work...see you guys for the show.

special surprise for you guys!

tune in to see!

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:26 pm

WFColonel56 wrote:
Ok I have cracked this code..........wait.....wait.....wait.......wait a sec more.....ok


Gibs you say that Brady is a winner. You confuse Brady himself with the team....The PATs are winners.

You say manning isnt a winner (in just) but you are wrong, he is just as much of a winner if not more than Brady is. The only diff is that the team in a whole are not winners (compared to the pats).

How can you say that manning out classes brady in just about every stat but brady is more of a winner than he is..... Its the teammmmmmmm

smh at the people who says that brady makes the tough clutch throws..... manning makes those throws all the time... But the diff is that the PATS WRs have more ice water in their veins to not choke on the catch. ANd the colts WRs have constantly choked over the past 7 or so years...And the latest example is in this SB....

.....i think i have gibs in cheakmate...lol jk. But I dnt see how you can respond to this

wait what?

you cant compare ice water in veins and "clutch" thats all a matter of OPINION. You can compare stats and wins/rings. If ANYTHING manning choked...INT to end the game.

in all seriousness though they are both great QBs with great numbers. I simply prefer a guy that has won 3 rings over a guy that has won 1.

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 7:27 pm

this Brady vs Peyton argument can go on and on and on and on and on for days, weeks, and even yearsssssssssssss! lol!

-Mili

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:26 pm

Ac3r- You say that stats don't matter and that is exactly where you contradict yourself. If this is the case then the greatest QB's of all time would go as follows:

Bradshaw and Montana with 4
Aikman and Brady with 3
Starr, Griese, Plunkett, Staubach Elway and Big Ben with 2
All the people with one must be just as good as Manning right? Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Phil Simms.

Basing greatness solely on SB rings is crazy and this is the proof right here.

Gibs- If Manning choked in the SB, don't forget the playoff games against Denver, SD and Indy when Brady threw game ending pics. Also, no one ever mentioned how he failed to bring his team back in the SB against the Giants with 50 seconds left and 3 TO's.
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:40 pm

The "Team" argument is so lol wut. The Colts averaged 12 win a year over a decade. More than the pats. MORETHAN ANY OTHER TEAM. The pats still scooped 2 more SB's.



Bashing one of these guys for the sake of the other is retarded tho. The simple fact is Brady has gotten it done in more clutch spots.

EDGE: Gisele Brady

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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:09 pm

So gibs you want the rams to draft Tim Tebow !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Your whole entire argument is about rings so you want T.T to be the 1st overall pick. You want NE to move up and draft tim #1 so you have a QB who is a plain winner when Brady retires in 2 years from just being to good to play the game......


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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:21 pm

Th3 Ac3r wrote:
Manning makes the clutch throws? Lets look at this from about 5 days ago.. Manning down 24-17, 4th quarter, super bowl, the UNSTOPPABLE Peyton Manning will lead his team down the field and score to tie the game, the super bowl.. What does he do? Chokes and throws a 74 yard pick 6..

I see how in that discription you fail to also point out that Wayne ran maybe the most lasy/sloppiest route ever recorded

Yes dude jumped the ball, it was a great play on the ball, he read all of his defensive reads.....But if Wayne even gives 2 sh!ts on the route dude would have never had the chance to jump the pass......Cause waynes body would be in front of his.....Or at the least he would be able to break up the pass.

Which also leads me back to my last post about the colts WRs letting manning down again.. Wayne had that pick 6 on him, and he dropped a TD pass, the other dude (rookie) dropped a wide open 3rd down pass. And someone else dropped a wide open 3rd down pass
Yes everyone drops the ball. But all of these kep drops and mistakes by WRs...... This is an NFL LIVE
COME ON MAN


Im not even a colts fan but i can see clearly, im not blinded by rings in which Brady only really led them to two.
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:29 pm

Of course!! Only Manning fans could blame Manning throwing a pick 6 on his wide receiver.. This is why its impossible to have a debate with you guys! Because to you, Manning never does anything wrong.. Oh, and Wayne dropped a fourth down TD pass because Manning was 5 yards away and went Brett Favre on him and threw the ball 90 miles per hour.. Even then it didnt matter they were still down 14 with like 40 seconds left.. And Wayne did try on that route!! He didnt even know Porter was behind him, he thought he was all alone, until he saw Porter running in the other direction with the ball.. And did you see the pass?? Go watch it again, it was about 1-2 yards to the right of Wayne, which is why he couldnt even make a play on the ball
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PostSubject: Re: Thank you Saints!   Fri Feb 12, 2010 1:03 pm

Colonel ,

IMO...tim tebow is a guy I want on my team. From all the reports I have read he is a morale booster and is a leader...will he get it done? I don't know..

But success in college shouldn't value into a comparison between brady and manning...its a stretch

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